The Pre-1920s List: Discussion and Suggestions (Decade Project Vol. 4)

An ongoing project to survey the best films of individual decades, genres, and filmmakers.
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matrixschmatrix
Joined: Tue May 25, 2010 11:26 pm

Re: Pre-1920s List Discussion and Suggestions

#51 Post by matrixschmatrix » Wed Apr 05, 2017 1:05 am

domino harvey wrote:Haha wow-- How does that even happen to a DVD box?
I think someone may have been using the individual discs as literal coasters. Maybe it was one of the people who was really upset when Criterion went dual format

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domino harvey
Dot Com Dom
Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2006 2:42 pm

Re: Pre-1920s List Discussion and Suggestions

#52 Post by domino harvey » Wed Apr 05, 2017 1:11 am

The former owners obviously didn't care enough to even list the correct box-- maybe a bitter ex-spouse of a film lover

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Saturnome
Joined: Sun Aug 12, 2007 5:22 pm

Re: Pre-1920s List Discussion and Suggestions

#53 Post by Saturnome » Wed Apr 05, 2017 1:34 am

matrixschmatrix wrote:I'm excited to hear it's actually good- I just thought it might be neat.
I didn't think it was good, just kind of interesting for a few things. Himmelskibet is the better film of the set!

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denti alligator
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Re: Pre-1920s List Discussion and Suggestions

#54 Post by denti alligator » Wed Apr 05, 2017 9:04 am

Has anyone seen Feuillade's Barrabas? I was surprised to find a very nice looking version (you know, 'out there in the Net'). I'll be revisiting all the Feuillades for this list, including Tih Minh, of which there is also a much, much cleaner version now available. Why can't we get official releases of these? Flicker Alley would surely want to jump on them.

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dustybooks
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Re: Pre-1920s List Discussion and Suggestions

#55 Post by dustybooks » Wed Apr 05, 2017 9:08 am

matrixschmatrix wrote:Yeah, I'm not complaining, even though it's a beat up ex library copy that had coffee stains I had to scrub off all over the discs. I've been wanting the first set in particular forever.
I just got this set recently and it's a tattered former library copy as well, and missing the outer box, but no complaints here either. I'm excited to dive into it soon. For anyone who can't find a physical copy, all but one or two of the films included on this first set are streaming at the NFPF's website.

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Tommaso
Joined: Fri May 19, 2006 10:09 am

Re: Pre-1920s List Discussion and Suggestions

#56 Post by Tommaso » Wed Apr 05, 2017 9:15 am

denti alligator wrote:Has anyone seen Feuillade's Barrabas? I was surprised to find a very nice looking version (you know, 'out there in the Net'). I'll be revisiting all the Feuillades for this list, including Tih Minh, of which there is also a much, much cleaner version now available.
I've seen both, and Barrabas is certainly the less interesting one because it's more conventional in terms of plot. Not bad at all, but it simply doesn't have the mystique of Fantomas or Les Vampires.

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denti alligator
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Re: Pre-1920s List Discussion and Suggestions

#57 Post by denti alligator » Wed Apr 05, 2017 9:19 pm

I just re-watched the first episode of Tih Minh. There's some great stuff here, but I'm not convinced this is on par with Fantomas, Judex, or Les Vampires. The better quality version I'm viewing makes a huge difference, though! I think Jonathan Rosenbaum ranks it along with Les Vampires among his 100 favorite films. Curious choice.

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Satori
Joined: Sun May 09, 2010 10:32 am

Re: Pre-1920s List Discussion and Suggestions

#58 Post by Satori » Thu Apr 06, 2017 7:52 am

I also want to say thanks for the Filibus recommendation from earlier, Saturnome. I love the Feuillades I've seen and want to see more of the pulpier stuff from the era. Not gonna lie, though, this is what really sold me:
Saturnome wrote:She then start to disguise as a man and flirt with the detective's daughter!
But I liked the whole thing. Her schemes are so over-the-top and elaborate and the airship allowed for some really delightful visuals. While the villains in these sorts of films are always cooler than the detectives, I thought it was particularly the case here. Not only is Detective Hardy a bore, he didn't seem to be especially bright, either. Or maybe it just seemed that way because Filibus was always a step or two ahead of him. Either way, I can't imagine anyone in the audience not rooting for her over him.

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Tommaso
Joined: Fri May 19, 2006 10:09 am

Re: Pre-1920s List Discussion and Suggestions

#59 Post by Tommaso » Thu Apr 06, 2017 12:28 pm

Hell's Hinges (Charles Swickard/William S. Hart, 1916): I'm not a huge fan of westerns, especially not of silent westerns, but this one was a knockout. Matrixschmatrix has already reviewed it perfectly on the previous page, so I have little to add. Extremely powerful and dark, it occasionally felt more like an antique tragedy and that extended climax indeed resembled Old Testament stories of utter destruction (Sodom and Gomorrha). Great stuff, and thanks for the recommendation!

Fräulein Piccolo (Franz Hofer, 1915): One of the leading German filmmakers of the 1910s, the name of director Franz Hofer is now little known. It seems that only 15 of his 84 films have survived, and even fewer are available for viewing. This one, however, was put online by Deutsche Kinemathek as part of the EFG 1914 project, and they made a good choice indeed. The wonderful Dorrit Weixler stars as the girl Lo, who returns from a girl's boarding school to her hometown. Her parents own an hotel and they are in trouble because the chambermaid has eloped with the 'piccolo' (the apprentice waiter). And so Lo has to alternately play both roles. Which leads to problems when she falls in love with a dashing young lieutenant, who however doesn't recognise that the 'piccolo' isn't a boy...

A very charming and delightful three-reeler with a resolute main actress. The fun the film makes of the army officers is necessarily mild (given that the country was at war when the film was made), and the cross-dressing is rather a means for creating amusing situations and mistaken identities than for carrying the erotic charge you would find three years later in Lubitsch's Ich möchte kein Mann sein. Nevertheless, this is the kind of film that clearly paved the way for Lubitsch's early comedies (and by pure chance, Lubitsch has a very small acting role in this film). This is where he came from originally, contentwise and also stylistically. But Fräulein Piccolo is far too well made, lively and endearing to be only interesting as a 'predecessor'. This is a very fine film which can easily stand on its own. You can watch it online here in excellent quality (albeit without music, but that goes for all of these EFG silents). You'll have to consult the backchannels for a custom-subbed version, though.

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lubitsch
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Re: Pre-1920s List Discussion and Suggestions

#60 Post by lubitsch » Thu Apr 06, 2017 2:39 pm

Those who consider watching Der Andere should be aware that it was just announced that it's in the next Edition Filmmuseum release in April https://www.edition-filmmuseum.com/prod ... -Kino.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; .

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denti alligator
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Re: Pre-1920s List Discussion and Suggestions

#61 Post by denti alligator » Thu Apr 06, 2017 2:48 pm

lubitsch wrote:Those who consider watching Der Andere should be aware that it was just announced that it's in the next Edition Filmmuseum release in April https://www.edition-filmmuseum.com/prod ... -Kino.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; .
Great, but curious that the films included in the set aren't mentioned.

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Tommaso
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Re: Pre-1920s List Discussion and Suggestions

#62 Post by Tommaso » Thu Apr 06, 2017 4:42 pm

They are, at least in the German version of the page. But as this is a set that may prove to be important for this round of the listmaking, here are the contents:

DVD 1

Straßenbahnfahrt durch Prag 1908, 2'
Erster Internationaler Wettbewerb für Luftschiffe und Flugmaschinen, Brescia 1909, 13'
Italienische Reisebilder 1907-1913, 20'
Nick Winter und der Diebstahl der Mona Lisa 1911, 10'
Die weiße Sklavin 1911, 55'
Theodor Körner 1912, 41'

DVD 2

300-Jahr-Feier des Hauses Romanoff 1913, 16'
Der Andere 1913, 77'
Die Herzensbrecherin 1913, 47'

DVD 3

Daddy-Long-Legs 1919, 99'
Táta Dlouhán 1919, 10' (Ausschnitt)

DVD 4

Rückkehr nach Zion 1921, 78'
Kafka geht ins Kino 1913, 55'

Great to see that it's now actually a 4-disc-set (instead of a 3-discer, as originally announced). I'm most excited about the Mack, of course. But Blom's "Die weiße Sklavin" is a great addition as well. Does anyone know what "Die Herzensbrecherin" is? Can't find it at imdb nor at filmportal.

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knives
Joined: Sat Sep 06, 2008 6:49 pm

Re: Pre-1920s List Discussion and Suggestions

#63 Post by knives » Thu Apr 06, 2017 5:19 pm

No clue, but I am surprised the film which served Kafka's most famous film quote was made for.

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denti alligator
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Re: Pre-1920s List Discussion and Suggestions

#64 Post by denti alligator » Thu Apr 06, 2017 5:23 pm

Wonderful!!
I didn't even see that there is a German version of the page. This is such a fantastic looking set. I'll have to pre-order.
Obvious "Kafka geht ins Kino" is not from 1913, but must be a documentary, no?

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Tommaso
Joined: Fri May 19, 2006 10:09 am

Re: Pre-1920s List Discussion and Suggestions

#65 Post by Tommaso » Thu Apr 06, 2017 5:49 pm

Yes, certainly it must be a new documentary, most likely this one from 2002. I don't know it, and the whole idea of releasing a dvd-set based on the films an author may or may not have seen (even if its Kafka) seems to be a bit dubious to me. You could equally release such a set with the focus on Joyce (who at least once toyed with the idea of opening a movie theatre in Dublin!) or on the equally important Arno Schmidt (who apparently was a great admirer of silent film actress Lya Mara, of whom I'd like to see a few films), but after all: who cares, if the Kafka angle finally serves as an excuse for getting a few rare 1910 films out officially. The Mack is a seminal piece of German filmmaking of this era, so that alone should be worth the admission price.

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denti alligator
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Re: Pre-1920s List Discussion and Suggestions

#66 Post by denti alligator » Thu Apr 06, 2017 6:02 pm

I agree, in part. Some recent scholarship has looked into the connection between these films (which we know for certain he saw, based on epistolary evidence and from diaries)--there's a book by Peter-Andre Alt that I have. Pretty good. But yeah, it's mainly to sell these titles!

Didn't know about Schmidt and Mara.

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knives
Joined: Sat Sep 06, 2008 6:49 pm

Re: Pre-1920s List Discussion and Suggestions

#67 Post by knives » Thu Apr 06, 2017 6:06 pm

Well, the choices aren't arbitrary. They all come from his diaries and other film criticisms and tie into a book analyzing his analysis as they tie into his literary work.

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Tommaso
Joined: Fri May 19, 2006 10:09 am

Re: Pre-1920s List Discussion and Suggestions

#68 Post by Tommaso » Thu Apr 06, 2017 6:55 pm

denti alligator wrote:Didn't know about Schmidt and Mara.
There's an excellent book by German scholar Guido Erol Öztanil on Schmidt and cinema. I was at a lecture where the author presented this book, and he showed some great excerpts from a very stylish mid-20s Lya Mara film which came directly from a Bundesarchiv copy which hasn't leaked so far. Made me swoon of course. Apart from this, Schmidt often made reference in his later works to early German sound film operettas which of course all haven't been released so far. In other words: I urgently want an "Arno Schmidt geht ins Kino"- set. ;)

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TMDaines
Joined: Wed Nov 11, 2009 1:01 pm
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Pre-1920s List Discussion and Suggestions

#69 Post by TMDaines » Thu Apr 06, 2017 7:26 pm

I'm hoping we get everything with original language intertitles, but Danish is conspicuously missing from the list of languages.
Tommaso wrote:Does anyone know what "Die Herzensbrecherin" is? Can't find it at imdb nor at filmportal.
It's a French film, La broyeuse de coeurs

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Tommaso
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Re: Pre-1920s List Discussion and Suggestions

#70 Post by Tommaso » Thu Apr 06, 2017 7:43 pm

Thanks, never heard of it. Seems we're in for some rather obscure titles. :-)

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TMDaines
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Pre-1920s List Discussion and Suggestions

#71 Post by TMDaines » Fri Apr 07, 2017 8:27 am

Any recommendations for fairly generic music to accompany silents that have been issued without a track? Got a lot of these on my PC that would be better served with audio accompaniment. Got Spotify if I can stream something from there.

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Lemmy Caution
Joined: Wed Mar 29, 2006 3:26 am
Location: East of Shanghai

Billie Holiday.

#72 Post by Lemmy Caution » Fri Apr 07, 2017 9:18 am

I had made a really good instrumental jazz playlist that went very well with silents. But that got lost. I made another recently, that's pretty decent. I'll see if I can drop it anywhere you can pick it up.

Actually all day today April 7, it's Billie Holiday radio on WKCR for her birthday.
A lot of vocals obviously, but I used it with volume somewhat low to an old Greta Garbo flick (The Temptress) with pretty good results. Really I just wanted to keep listening to Billie Holiday and didn't want to forget to get back to the broadcast after the film.

Edit: I only have it saved on my computer as a playlist, so I can't easily drop the files somewhere.
It's all 20's jazz, as usually I'm watching 1920's silent films. My playlist is primarily 20's Duke Ellington, and a bunch of violin tunes -- Stephane Grappeli, Joe South, Stuff Smith. I find the early violin jazz tunes work well.
I need to expand and order this new silent film music playlist.

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dustybooks
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Re: Pre-1920s List Discussion and Suggestions

#73 Post by dustybooks » Fri Apr 07, 2017 10:13 am

TMDaines wrote:Any recommendations for fairly generic music to accompany silents that have been issued without a track? Got a lot of these on my PC that would be better served with audio accompaniment. Got Spotify if I can stream something from there.
Yo La Tengo's The Sounds of the Sounds of Science and They Shoot, We Score have come in handy with this for me, as have lots of Eno albums (especially Apollo), though that's just my musical taste in general talking probably.

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knives
Joined: Sat Sep 06, 2008 6:49 pm

Re: Pre-1920s List Discussion and Suggestions

#74 Post by knives » Fri Apr 07, 2017 10:41 am

I usually go sans music, but either Edgar Elgar or Duke Ellington makes for good generic film music.

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Tommaso
Joined: Fri May 19, 2006 10:09 am

Re: Pre-1920s List Discussion and Suggestions

#75 Post by Tommaso » Fri Apr 07, 2017 11:04 am

Almost anything by Belgian composer/pianist Wim Mertens has served me well.

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